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Krishna Seva Krishna seva sada kariya(Always serve Lord Krishna)
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Pushtidas Tibari Star
Joined: 10 Oct 2005 Posts: 624 Location: United Kindom
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Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:26 am Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna
I can’t let the fourth or rather the tenth personality-type without mentioning here. So the tenth personality-type Gopis are known as ‘nirguna’. Nirguna are ‘who is free of the three qualities of worldly existence'. The simple translation is ‘transcendent’ and really this is precisely what nirguna means. And dear vaishnavs in this case there is no ambiguity or language difficulty. (He-he Palnaji you love this translations, don’t you!).
Now after analysing all differences in Gopis personalities we can imagine how Shree Krishna plays with different emotions and instigates his games and leelas with these Gopis. I am sure Krishna love varieties and hence, variety is the spice of leela.
When we look at the emotions which were portrayed by Nandbaba, can anyone tell what category does he belong to? _________________ Dasa nu das
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Nital Vaishnav
Joined: 14 Nov 2005 Posts: 36 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2007 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna,
I'm going to be daring and take a guess...is he nirghun and rajas bhav?!
Gopi Geet is a pleasure to read...
JSK
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Sital CEO
Joined: 07 Nov 2005 Posts: 478 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2007 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna
Thanks Pusthidasji for your prompt reply, you've cleared my confusion
Its a pleasure to see you on tibari Nitalji, I will take a guess as well...........Nirgun.......Sattva
Thanks Again
JSK _________________ Madhurkomalkant padavali namami
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palna CEO
Joined: 04 Nov 2005 Posts: 241 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2007 9:34 am Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna,
I was rereading Pushtidasji's previous posting and thought that
Quote: | "Nirguna" that is when Sattva, Rajas and Tamas gunna disappears. |
Meaning that once a bhakta reaches the stage of Nirguna the Quote: | "gunna(S,T,R) do take the secondary or none effect". |
The Niruguna bhakta being in a 'transcendental' state all the time there arfter?? Therefore Nirguna but not R,T or S.
Is my interpritation correct? _________________ Prem Bandhan Ajab Gajab, Brahmaganth sami aa ganth, na tutai na chutai
Palna na Koti Koti Jai Shree Krishna
Last edited by palna on Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:50 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Sital CEO
Joined: 07 Nov 2005 Posts: 478 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2007 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna
Palnaji, thanks for prompting this question, as I understood that when a devotee is in Sanyog with Thakorji they are Nirgun and thereafter it depends on each individual, how intense one’s devotion is and at what stage.
The Gopigeet Geet was sung after the Maharaas, which denotes the Gopi’s had previously experienced closeness with Thakorji. If they had all converted to being completely Nirgun then why was each stanza’s sung by a selected group according to their characteristics? Is there various phases in Nirgun then? Also only a number of gopi’s ended up with the Laghu Raas, others joined the Maharaas again which in my opinion also indicates various stages of bhakti.
Vaishnavs please join in with some feedback
JSK _________________ Madhurkomalkant padavali namami
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Nital Vaishnav
Joined: 14 Nov 2005 Posts: 36 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna,
Just to say that I look forward to the answer and it's wonderful explanation...(hint hint Pushtidasji!)
Palnaji, your explanation about the nirghun bhav made sense to me as initially I thought the same as you but having read over what Pushtidasji had written made me come to the same conclusion as Sitalji...but then asgain, I maybe wrong - let's wait for an ardent vaishnav to put our queries to rest....
JSK |
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Pushtidas Tibari Star
Joined: 10 Oct 2005 Posts: 624 Location: United Kindom
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Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 10:08 am Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna
Thank you Nitalji, I take the hint and the heed. Yes Palnaji, here is the request and clearance.
This is what Sitalji asked:
Quote: | The Gopigeet Geet was sung after the Maharaas, which denotes the Gopi’s had previously experienced closeness with Thakorji. If they had all converted to being completely Nirgun then why was each stanza’s sung by a selected group according to their characteristics? Is there various phases in Nirgun then? Also only a number of gopi’s ended up with the Laghu Raas, others joined the Maharaas again which in my opinion also indicates various stages of bhakti |
For start, let me make it very clear that although we all have different Gunn, we when in Sanmukh, that is in the closeness with God, change into Nirguna Gunn which only remains that way to initiate that celestial body that makes us worthy to feel and enjoy Thakorji. Once that Sanindhiya (closeness to Thakorji) is removed then the soul will be back to its original Gunn. That was the reason when the Gopis became lonely after Thakorji vanished from Maharaas, they adopted or rather re-entered into their original characters. That was why we had 19 different types of Gopis and each of them sang a stanza of Gopi Geet.
So to sum this insatiable transformation of characters, Sanindhiya infuses Nirguna bhava in the presence of Thakorji and once we are in a state of Vimukh (a state of loneliness that felt that Thakorji is no longer with them is called Vimukh period or avastha). State we regress into our original Gunn.
Although after saying this there is also another theory in existence:
When a soul is in Sanindhiya (close to god), the soul depicts the original Gunn with Nirguna Gunn. This means that if a soul is Tamas then in the presence of god, that soul will have Nirguna and Tamus Gunn and Rajas will depict Rajas Nirguna so does Sattva to Sattva Nirguna.
In this theory, the soul retains its character and also acquires the Nirguna bhava for Sanindhiya purposes. This is more convincing as Thakorji likes variety and in this theory that element does stay intact. This theory was first relayed by Shree Hariraiji Prabhucharan. Shree Mahaprabhuji wrote on only the nine different permutations of Rajas, Tamas and Sattva bhava. On taking Shree Hariraiji's theory forward then we have nine more categories of Nirguna with mixtures of all the elements described by Shree Vallabh. For instance:
Rajas:
When in Sanmukh or Sanindhiya (Presence of God) it will have
1. Rajas-Rajas-Nirguna
2. Rajas-Tamus-Nirguna
3. Rajas-Sattva-Nirguna
Tamus:
1. Tamus-Tamus-Nirguna
2. Tamus-Rajas-Nirguna
3. Tamus-Sattva-Nirguna
Sattva:
1. Sattva-Sattva-Nirguna
2. Sattva-Tamus-Nirguna
3. Sattva-Rajas-Nirguna
So Shree Vallabh's category of none character-elements and Shree Hariraiji Prabhucharan's nine category makes it eighteen characters and finally the top notch character Nirguna is added and this way we have a nineteen characters which were taken aboard on Maharaas.
I hope that the above explanation makes it much clearer. _________________ Dasa nu das
Pushtidas |
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Nital Vaishnav
Joined: 14 Nov 2005 Posts: 36 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 11:20 am Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna,
Thankyou Pushtidasji for your explanation, it has cleared up the confusion... however, I am still eagerly waiting for the answer as to what Nandbaba's bhav is?
JSK |
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palna CEO
Joined: 04 Nov 2005 Posts: 241 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna,
Yes, Thankyou Pushtidashjji, all doubts are cleared. I enjoyed the posting! _________________ Prem Bandhan Ajab Gajab, Brahmaganth sami aa ganth, na tutai na chutai
Palna na Koti Koti Jai Shree Krishna |
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Sital CEO
Joined: 07 Nov 2005 Posts: 478 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 10:51 am Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna
Thanks Pusthidasji, thoroughly enjoyed reading your superb explanation. Whilst Comparing these gunn and analysing human nature another question arose in my mind (Sorry) . Is it not true that we possess all three of these characteristics, even though one or two is more transparent and dominant than the other? Does this indicate that the Nirgun group was top-notch as they were completely transcendental and infused all 3 gunn spiritually towards Thakorji?
I remember at satsang we discussed that Tamus, Rajas and Sattva souls posses 84 gunn each, however nirguna soul possesses their own 84 gunn in addition to Tamas, Rajas and Sattva gunn, when added together, denotes they hold 336 gunn.
What happened to the Nirguna group when Thakorji left them and hid in their heart, as they were Nirgun by nature? Which original characteristics did they adopt when Thakorji vanished?
I hope my question is clearly phrased, if not then please let me know
Thanks
JSK _________________ Madhurkomalkant padavali namami
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